Building Careers and Community

Welcome, everybody, to The Hunt for Success. Today we have Tucker Green, a business owner, public servant, and advocate for the trades. He’s someone who understands that the skills you build in the field don’t necessarily stay in the field. They show up in every room that you walk into. Tucker, welcome to the show. Can you just start at the beginning? How did you get started in your career?

As my parents will tell you, I was kind of born an old soul. From the time I was little I didn’t meet a stranger, very social, very mature I guess for my age. And I had an interest in politics, and I don’t know why. I don’t come from a political family. I come from a civically minded family. They vote, they try to give back. They operate a small business and have since 1971, and they were always involved in their local chamber of commerce, sponsoring ball teams, things like that. Their advocacy organization is the one I now manage, so it was kind of a full circle moment. But nothing political. I was just drawn to government, to how civics works, locally, at the state, federally.

So how does that turn into a job?

I ended up going to the University of Georgia. I was the first in my family to go to school, and being a Georgia boy I wanted to go cheer on the Dawgs. While I was there some local folks back home in Pickens County came to me, a school board seat race was coming up, and they said, why don’t you run for school board? I ran and won that election. I was 21 at the time, and I became the youngest school board member in the state. That election brought some attention from people I knew but maybe hadn’t been as close to over the years. And there was a guy who had been a lobbyist, a former state representative, very involved in the political sphere, and he contacted me because he saw what I was doing, and basically hired me. I went to work for him when I graduated. After a short stint he decided to retire, and I ended up going out on my own, got a little bit of his book of business, and built on it. I wouldn’t say I planned any of it. A door would open and I’d have enough sense to walk through it.

Tell me more about Tucker Green & Associates, because there’s the firm and then there’s the lobbying, and then there’s CAAG.

My company is the overarching company that a lot of these organizations, including CAAG, contract with. It’s a governmental affairs firm, and we’re kind of unique. There are a lot of folks in the government affairs realm, but they don’t really do association management. We do full-scale association management for our clients, event planning, things of that nature, in addition to governmental affairs. And really we do that because of the need of our clients. My main client, the Conditioned Air Association of Georgia, was my first client and my biggest. That’s what they needed. They needed someone to manage their entire organization, the behind the scenes. We have a board of directors that provides leadership, but they rely on our company to run the organization day to day.

You were named one of the top five rising star lobbyists in Georgia. Is that something you’re proud of?

I was, and I was actually able to be named in that a couple of years. That list is put together by a publication here in the state that’s very involved in the business and political realm. How they compile it is they take nominations, and then people in our world, the lobbying world and the political world, vote and rank them. So to be named that by your peers, by colleagues, people who know the work you do, that meant a lot.

Are there wins at the Capitol that stick with you, that give you the steam to keep going?

We’ve had a lot of success and we’re proud of that, but a big part of it isn’t me. I give a lot of credit to the people we represent. They’re good, hardworking, respected businesspeople with good reputations in vital industries across our state, and when you’re advocating for people like that it makes your job a little easier. I learned early on that in government affairs, to use a sports analogy, you’re often playing defense more than offense. A lot of what we don’t get credit for is the bad policy we’re able to stop from becoming law. And honestly it’s easier to kill a bill than to get one signed. In a Georgia session there might be two thousand, twenty-five hundred bills introduced. Maybe two hundred and fifty or three hundred make it to the governor’s desk. It’s a tedious process by design, as it should be.

Is there a specific piece of legislation that really impacted you?

One of my proudest accomplishments. My predecessor was working on it before he hired me, so this is one of those labors of love. I worked on it with him, and then for a couple of years on my own after he retired. It was literally years. When I went out on my own I got it passed the House. There was a change in the Senate, so it passed there with changes and had to go back to the House to agree. They adjourned before that happened. So you get really, really close, and you still come up short, and then you start all over again.

What was the bill?

Regulatory fees, permit fees that HVAC companies, plumbers, electricians, builders have to pull with local governments. What we were seeing is that certain municipalities or counties were charging pretty egregious permitting and regulatory fees. Thousands of dollars tacked on. They were really becoming profit centers, and Georgia law prohibited that. Those fees were supposed to cover the cost of regulating, of doing the inspections, of making sure things were up to code. What took so long is the cities and counties opposed us vehemently. They did not like having restrictions on how they could determine those fees. Our argument all along was we have no problem with our folks having to pull permits and pay a fair price. But it’s not fair for our guys to quote a job, go pull a permit, and end up upside down because of a fee they never should have been charged.

And then what happened after it passed?

We’ve had jurisdictions fight us on it. We had to get attorneys involved and our law was upheld. In two different cities in this state they were still charging in violation of the new law. We had attorneys serve them, they had to reverse it, and they paid reimbursement checks back to our members. So there’s the win, and then there’s being vindicated, having their hand slapped and being told no, you need to follow the law, they’re right, and you need to pay these contractors back. It’s not every day you get a city to write you a check for saying, yeah, we overcharged you.

That’s got to feel good. You represent guys from one man in a van up to somebody with a hundred vans, and that hits every one of their paychecks and their employees’ paychecks.

It was a great accomplishment. We felt like we were advocating for what was right and what was fair. It’s good for our members and their bottom line, and it’s good for consumers too, because those fees have a domino effect. They get passed down.

How much time do you actually get to spend with your members? There’s over six hundred and fifty of them.

There’s no doubt it’s tough. I can’t go see all of them. But it’s important that I’m out and about, seeing them. One of my favorite things is to get in the truck, travel the state, go by their shops, go by their offices, break bread with them. I make a point at different times through the year to hit certain areas, sometimes existing members, sometimes recruiting. And anytime a member wants to meet with me, we make that happen. I think it’s important that we never lose sight and never lose connection with what they’re experiencing, what’s going on on the front lines every day. CAAG is really a family. The organization’s been around since 1980 and we have members who’ve been involved since then. I tell the new ones that a lot of the value is the connection, the network. Iron sharpens iron.

That win has to be more personal for you, coming from a family in the trades. You can empathize with those guys because you grew up that way.

No doubt it’s personal, and I tell folks that. I have a unique perspective because of my family’s business. I know what it takes to run one, and it’s not always rainbows and butterflies and all the great things people on the outside looking in think it is. It’s a lot of hard work and a lot of sacrifice.

More people with that perspective should be in politics.

I agree completely. My experience has been that the most effective legislators we deal with are people who can connect, who can relate, who themselves or whose families were in business. They understand what it takes to sign the front of a paycheck, not just the back of a paycheck.

All right, let’s get into it. You’re a hunter, and that’s part of the show. What do you like to hunt, and when did you start?

I love to hunt. We grew up as a family always being in the woods, and I’m grateful for that. I don’t have any kids yet, but the plan is to have them in a stand or hunting as much as we can, because you learn a lot of good lessons outdoors and around folks at hunting camp. I grew up a deer hunter. My family hunted everything, especially my granddad, who’s been all over the world. I grew up deer hunting in Georgia, and we had a lease in Selma, Alabama that I went to for years. That was perfect, because the Georgia season ends around December and Alabama’s really getting going.

And your granddad’s place in Iowa?

About twenty years ago he went in with some friends and got some land, a farm in southwest Iowa, and over the years developed it into an outfit. So I’ve been fortunate to go out there quite a bit. It’s a whole different ballgame. You look at those deer and you think it’s cattle out in the field, as big as they grow those corn-fed deer. It’s a lottery draw, so I don’t go every year. About every other year. And I’ll add on, I also love bird hunting, but I really hadn’t done much of it growing up. Really just in the last six, seven years did I start bird hunting, quail primarily, and I love it. I’d go quail hunting every day if I could. I hate to say it, but I probably enjoy it more than deer hunting.

There’s a lot of camaraderie in it. You can hunt with a group.

You raise a good point, it’s very different. Bird hunting, you’re with the guys, you’re watching the dogs work, a little more action. Deer hunting for me is almost therapeutic. I can sit in the stand and forget the world for a while.

One piece of advice, since you said you don’t have kids yet. Hunt as much as you can now. You’re going to take a couple of years off. That’s one of the regrets I have, all the time I had before I had a family and I’d sleep in and not go.

I think you’re exactly right. That’s good advice.

Anything on the bucket list?

I really haven’t had a chance to kill anything besides whitetail and birds. I’d love to kill an elk. That’d be pretty close to the top. Elk, a moose, maybe a bear, mainly North American. I’d be open to travel the world. I’ve got some lobbying friends who go to Europe every year and hunt stag, and I’ve never done that. And I’ve got a friend who wants us to do the turkey grand slam, so that might be on the list too.

I’m a gear fanatic, so I always ask. What are you shooting?

I’ve always been a 260, 270, 280 guy, somewhere in that realm. Lately I’m shooting a 280. I had my wife hunting with a 260 last fall. That’s just what I grew up hunting with as a teenager and I’ve stuck with it. In Iowa, obviously, we’re not hunting with those. It’s slug shotguns out there, no long rifles, and that’s a different experience I had to adjust to. For birds I’m an over-under guy. I’ve got a 20-gauge over-under I like a lot, and depending on the bird I’m either a 20 or a 12.

Is there anything you always take with you?

If it’s winter I’ve got a lucky toboggan, I like to think. It’s looking kind of dingy and nasty now, but that’s my toboggan and I always take it. And I wear the same bird vest, an orange one that’s got blood stains on it and everything else, given to me by a good family friend. It’s so big I can snap it over my winter deer gear, so now it’s just my permanent vest. I wear it bird hunting, deer hunting, no matter what.

Every hunter is a little bit superstitious.

I agree with that. I always do it in Iowa. We pack the backpack with snacks and drinks before we go out, and I always pack a little bottle of Coke and a honey bun. That’s my go-to. I don’t like to do anything besides honey bun and Coke. Don’t publish that in Health magazine.

You talked about how long you fought for that signature win. Do you find there’s a correlation between the patience and the waiting in hunting and the work you do at the Capitol?

I’ve never really thought of it quite like that, but I think you’re exactly right. I’m not naturally a very patient person. I’m the kind of person who wants results, I don’t like to waste time. But you have to adjust. You have to accept reality, and I think that’s something you develop in the outdoors. Hunting, fishing, whatever it might be, it’s not instant. You may go days or weeks and not see anything, or you may have one particular deer you’re chasing all season. Part of my raising too was the value of hard work, that if anything’s worth doing it’s worth doing right. That’s what I try to keep even when we have setbacks or delays. Keep your head down. If it’s important enough, if you think it’s the right thing to do, keep working at it until you get there.

That’s what I’m trying to teach my boys and girls. You don’t always win. You don’t always kill something, you don’t always catch something.

That’s exactly right. I remember playing sports growing up, and there’d be years with a bad team or a coach you didn’t like, and Mom and Dad always said, you don’t have to play next year if you don’t want to, but when you’re signed up, you’re going to finish. You’re going to finish the season whether you like it or not. I think in our society there’s a little too much of the opposite now. If you’re uncomfortable or you don’t like something, you can just quit. That’s not real life. There are times when you’re going to be uncomfortable, times when you’re going to lose, times when you have to do things you don’t want to do. It all makes us stronger in the long run.

Hunting can be very humbling, and I imagine your job can be too. You put all the time and effort in and still lose.

In this line of work you can lose for no fault of your own. That’s just the nature of politics. I remember the first time it happened to me, and you talk about a tough pill to swallow. It was that legislation I eventually got passed. We passed the House, the Senate made changes, it went back, and we didn’t get an agree in time. The clock was running late. The sponsor of our bill had gotten sideways with leadership on something else, unrelated to our bill. Not what they wanted him to do on something else, and he got penalized for it. He got put in the penalty box, and they said anything to do with him is not getting called up for a vote. And that’s what happened, and we became a kind of victim of it.

And that one hurt.

It was tough, because it was early in my career and we’d put so much work in. I had a lot of pride in it, not only for the connection to my family and the businesses we represent, because I knew the impact it was having on them, but also because it was my first piece of legislation out on my own after I’d left my mentor. I felt like I’d let everybody down. I thought I could accomplish something he wasn’t able to finish. It was frustrating, because what do you do? There was nothing I could do. But we came back and didn’t give up and got it done. The loss was hard, but the victory became even sweeter.

It’s like missing a deer. You’ve been there all morning, you froze your toes off, and you miss the shot. The first elk I killed, I’d hunted three years. The first two years I never saw an elk. A buddy saw the picture and said, I’ve never seen you smile like that.

That’s right.

For a young person trying to figure out their way, maybe thinking about politics or law, what advice would you give them?

The last couple of years I’ve taken a couple of college-age people under my wing, interns, tried to give them opportunities. It’s been frustrating at times. I’ve had success and not success with it, and I’ve had people around the Capitol ask why I spend time doing that. And I say, somewhere down the road somebody gave me a shot, gave me an opportunity, and I feel like it’s my responsibility to do the same. If I can have a positive impact on them, I think it’s worthwhile. Some of what young people face right now is challenging and different. It’s an evolving world, technology, societal norms, all of it. It’s a weird time. But I also believe we live in the greatest country on earth, we have more opportunities than anybody else, we still control our own destiny, and there’s so much you can accomplish if you’re willing to put in the work, to put your head down and not care who gets credit, to do the hard stuff, to do the nasty jobs, to do what it takes.

And beyond the work?

Honor your name. The name you have and the reputation you have. Stand by your word, mean what you say, do what you mean. To me the most important traits and values are honesty, integrity, hard work, work ethic. Everything else falls into place. Young people feel all this stress and pressure, I’ve got to have this job, this internship, this college, this GPA. I don’t want to say none of that matters, but at the end of the day I think those are the small things. The big things are being willing to do the hard things, the tough things, to keep a positive attitude, to work hard and keep a good name. If you do those things, you’re going to find success in life.

Plus if you do those things you’re such a minority that you’re going to have success, because there aren’t enough of you.

That’s exactly right. There’s a lot of opportunity out there for someone who’s just willing to work hard.

Where can people find you and CAAG?

We’re on social media, personally on Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram and Twitter, and CAAG is on LinkedIn, Instagram and Facebook. We both have a website, tuckergreenandassociates.com for my business, and caag.org. Really good organizations helping really good people, hardworking folks out there. If we could ever do anything to help, or if people want to learn more, we’d be glad to connect.